User configurable interface to emulate a keyboard/mouse/Joy

Questions and answers about 3Dconnexion devices on Windows.

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Post by Cafim » Fri Mar 04, 2011 1:54 pm

jwick wrote:I am not sure why you guys think posts like these will help get you into what is a very active ongoing beta program. Unfortunately, I have to tell you, they don't help your cause. I read every post someone makes before sending an invitation..
Nowhere in my post did I say that I wanted to be part of a closed beta. The fact alone that there is still an "active ongoing beta program" (as a recent comment, as opposed to the dated one) would have made me feel as though there was at least hope to get a working driver in this decade, and would have mollified me. You've said nothing of substance for some time until now.

My issue is that six months ago you said that this closed beta would become an open beta, that this would be part of the next 3Dxware release. Your having said that implies a reasonable amount of time, as six months is an eternity in software. (Just look at Aut*desk's 1 year turn around on their products.) I have every right to expect that the hardware vendor would support the product I paid for (in reference to those new ones purchased before I moved to used ones), or at least pay me the respect to keep me informed. That doesn't cost you anything at all, and doesn't mean you have to divulge anything that would violate NDAs.

And I'm not sure why you can't understand why users like me are extremely unhappy, to the point of being bitter. All it takes is a post saying that development is ongoing, or that timelines are extended, that the goal is to have something in the next X days/months, barring unexpected delays, which you'll update in Y days/months. Again, you don't have to say anything concrete, nor provide details. Putting on a cloak of secrecy makes you seem arrogant, removed, and uncaring about your users.
jwick wrote:Many other people who have positively contributed to this forum are now actively helping to shape the software for their own use. We greatly appreciate their input and respond personally to every suggestion they make.
I appreciate their input also, and hope that the final product will be all supernovas and fairy dust. Not everyone has the time to be contributory, and I don't what's wrong with my desire to have functional product. I'd have bought two more SPPs if they were. (And new, if the support was worth it.)
jwick wrote:They are all under NDA. They can't respond to you.
What a beta tester has to say isn't relevant to me. YOU are the developer. They could all be tickled pink about it, and you could not release it for another six months because there's a chance that the driver will crash on a Commodore 64, or not work the first version of AutoCAD.
jwick wrote:We do appreciate the enthusiasm you have for your 3D mouse.
And it's a terrible shame that I'm coming to loathe its developer. I actually quite like having good relationships with my vendors. I've had terrific dealings with support from companies like S*ny, Panas*nic, Sams*ng, Micr*s*ft, and others. Not because they gave me anything, or did something unexpected. They were prompt, professional, and as soon as I expressed displeasure, they asked what they could do, not implied that I wasn't "helping my cause". The only thing that does is costs you customers... which, last time I checked, is what companies require to exist.

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Post by zzz2496 » Sun Mar 06, 2011 7:35 pm

Well said, Cafim... Well said...

jwick, the fact that you *only* reads these threads is what makes me (and probably other users) upset. As a representative of 3Dconnexion, there's no harm done by posting updates of the driver's progress. You do know that many of your customers are waiting patiently (some even waits for years) for this driver to come out.

As for me, I was interested in the new driver and passionately wait for it (that was 4 months ago). I even dare to dream that I can be included in the close beta program... Turns out, your newest post hurts me as a paying customer. Now I officially have a brand new, unused SPP paper weight.

I don't know if you understand the facts, but bad mouthing between your customers can and will drive your current (and future) customers away.

Thank you for your sharp words.


PS. I should've bought the cheapest one instead of the highest one...

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Post by staschi » Mon Mar 07, 2011 1:26 pm

The developer of Xpadder fixed a bug occurred by puck movement within a week. But to add puck interaction he will need to update how Xpadder reads axis. He adds the suggestion for a future update. I'm curious who will be the first one to release.

The button assignment already works great without an modified driver.

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Xpadder SpacePilot

Post by staschi » Mon Mar 07, 2011 2:08 pm


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Post by rusti » Tue Mar 29, 2011 11:23 am

rusti wrote:Spacepilot is a good input.

If I followed this thread thoroughly enough I think jwick you confirmed that the upcoming driver will support SpacePilot Pro and SpaceNavigator for Notebooks. Is it safe to assume that the other current products SpaceExplorer and SpaceNavigator will also be supported? On top of that will any no longer current products still be supported with the new drivers? Most interestingly the SpaceTraveller and the SpacePilot (without pro)?

Can't wait to have a 6DOF device with such a flexible driver.
I am still very interested in getting an answer to the above questions. Anyone?

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Post by Fred » Tue Mar 29, 2011 11:38 am

The driver will only support Spacepilot Pro, SpaceExplorer,
SpaceNavigator, SpaceNavigator FN.
There are no plans to support Legacy products.

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Post by DragonFist » Tue Mar 29, 2011 6:41 pm

Well, that just sucks.

Frankly, this kind of functionality should have been in the drivers from the beginning. Not having it has resulted in $500 paper weights.

Fortunately, I'm sure some ingenious community members will come up with a way to add support, but struggling to get third party solutions to work with my OS and then waiting, patiently, for literally months for these new drivers since they were announced, I come in to check where things are at and I see this.

I wasn't upset before. I was just waiting. But I can tell you right now, this just guaranteed that I will never buy another product from this company. The devices have had extremely limited use for me thus far and while they have great potential, the company just told me that they have no plans to make my current device useful for more than the 2 apps I can use it in. If I want to use one in other circumstances, I'll have to shell out several hundred dollars for one of the new ones.

I really don't appreciate it. And if the answer to being able to use my spacepilot is buy a space pilot pro, I won't do it. I can tell you that.

I'll spend that money on an upgrade to one of my 3D apps, and use a freakin mouse and keyboard.

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Post by DragonFist » Tue Mar 29, 2011 7:32 pm

And I just have to get this out:

When was the spacepilot released? 2007? I think so. So 3-4 years is what it takes for companies to stop supporting their products nowadays?

Well, that just makes me want to run out and buy a $500 dollar SpacePilot Pro, so it can be unsupported in about 2 years.

And what does it take to add support for a device that is nearly identical, in terms of device control connections, to every one of the "supported" devices other than the SpacePilot Pro (which I've read on these forums worked differently in some way) ? From what I've seen with the third party drivers, adding support was as simple as adding the device code to the .inf file.

There's the LCD, but hell, that isn't even needed, really. the puck and the buttons can't be that different than the other devices, we're not talking about a serial port device here. The same basic data is being passed along the same kind of connection. I'm not saying there is no difference, but I can't really see any significant reason to drop a 3-4year old device working on the same basic tech as the current items from the driver list. Not on an input device.

Hell, I can still get fully functional drivers for graphics cards almost a decade old. Sure, there might be newer ones for newer devices, but if my card can play a game, I can install the latest drivers and it will work!

My device is fully capable of moving my mouse pointer around the screen or playing the latest games or moving geometry in 3D apps, BUT if the maker of those programs didn't, themselves write support for the device, I can't because the device drivers don't allow it on their own. For a while, third parties addressed this, but those drivers are stale-dated and hard to use on Win7 64bit.

The bottom line is the manufacture failed to deliver usable drivers for a device that on the low end cost more than a pro mouse up to a price range well beyond normal for an input device. Yet, when you finally announce that you are going to provide a flexible driver that will allow the device to be used in a wide range of programs, you fail to make it available to costumers that own the last generation of products.

That says a lot in my book. It clearly states "If you bought any device not in the absolutely latest generation of our products, don't expect working drivers."

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Post by jwick » Thu Mar 31, 2011 5:58 am

We have released 3DxWare 10 open beta.

This release includes keyboard, mouse and joystick emulation.

Please try it out and let us know what you think. There is a new 3DxWare 10 Beta Forum for discussion.

I'm locking this thread so users who get informed about changes to the thread won't miss this announcement. Feel free to start a new thread to continue this discussion, if you wish.