No SpacePilot support in 3DxWare 10 Beta

[Bowtie Bob]

I understand the need to stop support of older devices at some point, but I am curious as to why the original SpacePilot isn't supported in this driver as it's construction and funcion is so similar to the current gen products.

[DragonFist]

I understand the need to stop support of older devices at some point, but I am curious as to why the original SpacePilot isn't supported in this driver as it's construction and funcion is so similar to the current gen products.

I don't understand it when the previous drivers were never gotten to a truly functional state with the older devices.

I am really, really pissed that my spacepilot doesn't work with these. (the LCD lights up and it apparently knows I have a space pilot attached (there is a driver profile) but beyond that, the software claims no device is attached. I've been waiting on these drivers for a long time as this device goes mostly unused except for some very limited situations where it is useful due to the old drivers. I've tried the 3rd party drivers to no avail. Now the company is releasing drivers that would make the damned thing useful and is ignoring my device because it is "last generation" and "legacy" which are just terms used to say we don't support our products once we've made new ones.

I am NOT a happy customer. I expect a company to provide me with a working product before I buy other products from the same company. I'm not "upgrading" if they can't even make the one I already bought work.

[philnolan3d]

I am really, really pissed that my spacepilot doesn't work with these. (the LCD lights up and it apparently knows I have a space pilot attached (there is a driver profile) but beyond that, the software claims no device is attached.

I've gotta say this really bugs me as well. I just bought this SpacePilot and now the latest drivers are not going to work with it.

[DragonFist]

I am really, really pissed that my spacepilot doesn't work with these. (the LCD lights up and it apparently knows I have a space pilot attached (there is a driver profile) but beyond that, the software claims no device is attached.

I've gotta say this really bugs me as well. I just bought this SpacePilot and now the latest drivers are not going to work with it.

The thing is, if the previous drivers were functional drivers, i.e., users and app makers didn't have to hard-code support into their apps for the thing to be useful, I wouldn't have a problem.

It would be like losing the use of your graphics card, not because a new game has some new shader model your card doesn't support but because the card requires every game to directly support it. No one would buy such a graphics card.

The it doesn't take much of a google search or a search on these forums find out how long users have been asking for this functionality for these devices. It is finally being provided but if you don't have the absolute lastest generation of product, you're out in the cold. It is not cool.

[CPConsult]

I am really, really pissed that my spacepilot doesn't work with these. (the LCD lights up and it apparently knows I have a space pilot attached (there is a driver profile) but beyond that, the software claims no device is attached.

I've gotta say this really bugs me as well. I just bought this SpacePilot and now the latest drivers are not going to work with it.

The thing is, if the previous drivers were functional drivers, i.e., users and app makers didn't have to hard-code support into their apps for the thing to be useful, I wouldn't have a problem.

It would be like losing the use of your graphics card, not because a new game has some new shader model your card doesn't support but because the card requires every game to directly support it. No one would buy such a graphics card.

The it doesn't take much of a google search or a search on these forums find out how long users have been asking for this functionality for these devices. It is finally being provided but if you don't have the absolute lastest generation of product, you're out in the cold. It is not cool.

I think that if their strategy is too force movement to their newer devices they are doing it too early. A quick cruise of the internet leads me to believe that they are going to leave a lot of their vendors holding devices that are not worth much as they are no longer factory supported. I would hope that it is just the beta release that does not support some legacy

[CPConsult]

Well, I have been informed that it is very much a conscious decision not to support even the SpacePilot! Evidently the driver contains everything to support the SpacePilot, but, the properties panel is programmed to ignore the device. As the owner of a fleet of two SpacePilots and one SpacePilot Pro that really makes me wonder about what direction our future purchases will be going in. They are not the only 3D mouse maker! I went with them because of market dominance, but, this is too small and savvy owners group to stay loyal when decisions like this are put forth.

[DragonFist]

Well, I have been informed that it is very much a conscious decision not to support even the SpacePilot! Evidently the driver contains everything to support the SpacePilot, but, the properties panel is programmed to ignore the device. As the owner of a fleet of two SpacePilots and one SpacePilot Pro that really makes me wonder about what direction our future purchases will be going in. They are not the only 3D mouse maker! I went with them because of market dominance, but, this is too small and savvy owners group to stay loyal when decisions like this are put forth.

Yeah, I spent some time last night trying to get it to work and the driver indeed works interms of the RawInput. Programs that already had support work. But the profile manager doesn't see it. I tried adding the device to the config but that resulted in the profile manager throwing errors with reading xml (since I don't know actually know how the drivers work, I clearly didn't put the right data or didn't handle every place it needs to be, etc.)

I am definitely sorry that I bought the the spacepilot now and I am kinda glad that I didn't buy the PRO, because even though that would work with this, it is clear devices become "legacy" very fast (wasn't the spacepilot still being officially sold only a year or so ago?)

[CPConsult]

Yeah, I spent some time last night trying to get it to work and the driver indeed works interms of the RawInput. Programs that already had support work. But the profile manager doesn't see it. I tried adding the device to the config but that resulted in the profile manager throwing errors with reading xml (since I don't know actually know how the drivers work, I clearly didn't put the right data or didn't handle every place it needs to be, etc.)

I am definitely sorry that I bought the the spacepilot now and I am kinda glad that I didn't buy the PRO, because even though that would work with this, it is clear devices become "legacy" very fast (wasn't the spacepilot still being officially sold only a year or so ago?)

From what I can see they are still available new on the internet. I would not be a happy camper if I was a re-seller of theirs! Your point is very valid, what stops them from "re-packaging the Pro" and making our "pro" legacy, well really at any point?

[BeatKitano]

Well, I have been informed that it is very much a conscious decision not to support even the SpacePilot! Evidently the driver contains everything to support the SpacePilot, but, the properties panel is programmed to ignore the device. As the owner of a fleet of two SpacePilots and one SpacePilot Pro that really makes me wonder about what direction our future purchases will be going in. They are not the only 3D mouse maker! I went with them because of market dominance, but, this is too small and savvy owners group to stay loyal when decisions like this are put forth.

Yeah, I spent some time last night trying to get it to work and the driver indeed works interms of the RawInput. Programs that already had support work. But the profile manager doesn't see it. I tried adding the device to the config but that resulted in the profile manager throwing errors with reading xml (since I don't know actually know how the drivers work, I clearly didn't put the right data or didn't handle every place it needs to be, etc.)

I am definitely sorry that I bought the the spacepilot now and I am kinda glad that I didn't buy the PRO, because even though that would work with this, it is clear devices become "legacy" very fast (wasn't the spacepilot still being officially sold only a year or so ago?)

Don't bother, the propertie panel is coded without the space pilot entries. You can edit the xml all you wxant, there is no code backing those changes.

I've been trying out a space pilot pro for a few weeks now, working in a high tech multinational, with probably a quite important revenue opportunity for 3dconnexion, but seeing that kind of marketing trick beeing pulled off. I don't think I will greenlit a deployment just to get all the devices replaced in a few years because it's the 3dconnexion policy to play obsolete programming.

[BeatKitano]

What I don't understand is that Logitech has the reputation to have one of the best tech support out there, what's going on 3dconnexion ?

Should we think that 3dconnexion is so small and poorly funded that it needs to sacrifice its early buyers to keep the company rolling ?
I really don't understand the strategy here, you're only going to get very bad press out of this.

You still have local resellers offering brand new spacepilot

http://www.ldlc.com/fiche/PB00058985.html
http://www.amazon.com/3D-Connexion-133031000-3DConnexion-SpacePilot/dp/B00094OX4G
http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B0009MG6FW/ref=dp_olp_0?ie=UTF8&redirect=true&qid=1301687916&sr=1-4&condition=all

That, and the automatic unnoficial driver threads locked uphttp://www.3dconnexion.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=25. Are you trying to keep the chatter to a minimum level ?

[CPConsult]

They have remained very quiet on this forum regarding this issue, well other than responding to one post above. They have to know this policy is unacceptable and will be posted about all over the internet.

Explore new marketing opportunities and grow the ones that you have, do not expect that existing customers will follow you after you essentially BURN them.

[DragonFist]

Glad to see that I am not the only one that sees it this way and has the courage to voice it.

I know that I will not be quiet about it. I wasn't happy with the driver support (i.e., the application maker must essentially write its own driver [I thought we left that behind with DOS]) but then it was announced that fully fledged drivers were coming out in one of the third party driver threads (actively discouraging that community member from creating such a driver on the basis that one was being created and that one would be a waste of time). So I waited. Then a few days before release as a beta it gets mentioned that "legacy" devices would not be supported.

So, not only are they not supporting all their costumers with fully fledged drivers, they prevented a community member from creating creating a set.

This gets to me as it was pretty clear that there were owners of the SpacePilot interested in these. The whole thing reeks of "Obsolescence by Design". This is a high-end input device. I expected better service and support than this. Hell, I'd expect better for a $10 mouse.

[DragonFist]

They have remained very quiet on this forum regarding this issue, well other than responding to one post above. They have to know this policy is unacceptable and will be posted about all over the internet.

I'm going to start contacting hardware/tech sites that have given reviews for the 3Dconnexion devices and inform them of this situation.

I'm sure if some of them start bringing the issue to press, the silence on this subject will change.

[CPConsult]

I know that I will not be quiet about it. I wasn't happy with the driver support (i.e., the application maker must essentially write its own driver [I thought we left that behind with DOS]) but then it was announced that fully fledged drivers were coming out in one of the third party driver threads (actively discouraging that community member from creating such a driver on the basis that one was being created and that one would be a waste of time). So I waited. Then a few days before release as a beta it gets mentioned that "legacy" devices would not be supported.

So, not only are they not supporting all their costumers with fully fledged drivers, they prevented a community member from creating creating a set.

Really? Are you kidding me? Guess I am very naive, I initially was assuming that it was something they would add in when they went non-beta. It is very clear now that this is a deliberate attempt to force obsolescence of nearly new products. We as consumers should not stand for this and should tell all of our fellow industry people of this pitfall. Corporate penny pinchers!

[dnashj33]

I understand the need to stop support of older devices at some point, but I am curious as to why the original SpacePilot isn't supported in this driver as it's construction and funcion is so similar to the current gen products.

I have been a big, big advocate of 3DConnexion devices...even coordinated with a Software developer to use the devices at their booth during SIGGRAPH 2010, and was practically selling passersby on their usefulness within the application.

But now...this marketing stunt (arbitrarily excluding SpacePilot from being supported in this driver) has me so ticked off, I will never buy another 3DX device, nor will I recommend them any longer. Whoever had the bright idea to try and force former customers to buy new hardware when they already invested $400+ and the devices work fine.

This IS NOT a matter of 3DConnexion not investing in their older devices. This is flat out a marketing maneuver on their part to force previous customers to HAVE to buy again. I'm sorry, but I won't be forced to buy anything from some yahoo in marketing, thinking that this is a good idea. Absolutely no excuse for this...none. Wacom doesn't pull this underhanded kind of stunt, and it's one reason why I'll buy from them again, when I'm ready to. Not when THEY want me too.